2010-08-25

05:42 LoqiLog joined #geoloqi
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17:00 <jtbandes> aaronpk: so for refreshing the access token, is there a way I could do a refresh call & regular API call all at once, rather than calling with the refresh token and then again with the actual token?
17:00 <aaronpk> hm, that doesn't sound familiar
17:00 <aaronpk> you'll need to make two calls
17:00 <aaronpk> interesting idea tho
17:01 <jtbandes> alright
17:03 <aaronpk> LOQI WHERE DID YOU GO??
17:04 <jtbandes> :'(
17:07 Loqi joined #geoloqi
17:07 <aaronpk> welcome back, loqi!
17:07 <Loqi> Loqi is done
17:17 faddah joined #geoloqi
17:17 <faddah> ok
17:18 <faddah> so donpdonp sez this is the best way to get you guys updates on my tests
17:18 <faddah> so anyone there?
17:18 <faddah> anyone? anyone? bueller...?
17:18 <faddah> {watches tumbleweed roll around irc channel...}
17:18 <faddah> faddah give Loqi a nudge.
17:22 <donpdonp> hi faddah
17:22 <faddah> yeah, this is working out soooooooo much better than twtter.
17:23 <donpdonp> interesting feedback. glad you're paying attention to accuracy :)
17:23 <donpdonp> when the phone tracking data looks like this chart, http://www.flickr.com/photos/donpdonp/4883524572/
17:23 <donpdonp> it'll be easier to answer 'why didnt i get a track during time X to time Y?'
17:24 <faddah> i don't understand how/why the two correlate? is that chart an expected or optimum hypothesis, or is it actually pulled from someone's data?
17:25 <donpdonp> an expected capability
17:25 <donpdonp> when you say 'didn't track me back from se 45th & belmont carts,'
17:25 <donpdonp> then the chart can be referenced
17:25 <donpdonp> 'hey there was no GPS coverage during that time'
17:26 <donpdonp> maybe the phone was wrapped in burrito tinfoil or something
17:27 <faddah> yeah, well, on the iPhone 4, the battery life part is probably close (or maybe even too optimistic), but there's no reason it ever needs to go to access point. thing has a gps chip in it. should always be pinging off the satellite to know where i am. if it's pinging the cell tower on se 42nd, that means it's going off 3G/Edge chipset instead, or worse, if that's actual the comcast cable location, that means it's going off wifi.
17:27 <faddah> the phone was in my (very flimsy) shorts pocket or out on the picnic table
17:28 <faddah> never "wrapped" in anything
17:28 <@jtbandes> @jonsterling I just wrote up a block-based solution for @geoloqi as well. Couldn't you just do that on a separate thread anyway?
17:28 <donpdonp> faddah: i think the source of the location fix is up to iOS. im not sure how much control (if any) the code has
17:28 <faddah> and should be checking & defaulting to gps chipset
17:29 <donpdonp> yeah i think iOS takes that control away and gives it a best guess based on some secret iOS rules as to when to use cell, etc.
17:29 <faddah> your code can make sure gps chipset is always default, should only go elsewhere if there is a massive gps #FAIL.
17:29 <donpdonp> i could be wrong
17:29 <donpdonp> im not that familiar with the inner workings of iOS here.
17:29 <faddah> then i can run a debug version with breakpoints set so you can see when it's going elsewhere than GPS chipset & why.
17:30 <faddah> anyway, who wrote the iPhone version?
17:30 <jtbandes> I'm working on it
17:30 <jtbandes> I don't know who wrote the original location bits, but I've worked with that part some
17:32 <faddah> hey, pTerm'g in right now to my network redux shared webhost via iPad pTerm app! i'm so 7337!
17:32 <jtbandes> 7337 = doing it wrong :P
17:32 <donpdonp> jtbandes: is it possible to determine the 'source' of a position report from iOS?
17:32 <faddah> sez who?
17:33 <faddah> see if i ever friend you on facebook again, jtbandes... IF THAT'S YER REAL NAME?!?!
17:33 <jtbandes> donpdonp: hrmm.... nope, don't think so
17:33 <jtbandes> faddah: im 17 and what is this
17:35 <faddah> I saw sparks fly, from the corner of my eye
17:35 <faddah> And when I turned, it was love at first sight
17:35 <faddah> I said please excuse me, I didn't catch your name
17:35 <faddah> Oh it'd be a shame not to see you again
17:35 <faddah> And just when I thought she was comin' to my door
17:35 <donpdonp> faddah: donpark.org/people says your last update is a day old
17:36 <faddah> @geoloqi was showing me about 1 - 2 hours ago with my li'l' ol' blip @ s.e. 45th & belmont. honest injun, took it out & checked several times while there.
17:37 <donpdonp> k.
17:38 <aaronpk> hey there
17:38 <aaronpk> i was in the car
17:38 caseorganic joined #geoloqi
17:38 <aaronpk> reading backlogs
17:41 <faddah> and i quote: "Include the gps string if your application requires the accuracy offered only by GPS hardware."
17:41 <aaronpk> cool, we can add that in as a checkbox
17:42 <donpdonp> it looks like a startup requirement, as it dont launch unless the phone has GPS hardware.
17:42 <aaronpk> faddah: it looks like all the data recorded from your phone in the last 24 hours has been rough location (500-meter accuracy)
17:42 <aaronpk> the feed that don is seeing ignores data less accurate than 200m I believe
17:43 <faddah> se 42nd & powell is far more than 500 meters
17:43 <aaronpk> ooh there's a couple 805 meters
17:43 <aaronpk> haven't seen that one before
17:43 <faddah> try about a mile (1600 meters)
17:43 <faddah> and i'm at home, which is s.e. 60th @ madison
17:44 <faddah> before that, i was s.e. hawthorne @ caesar chavez
17:44 <faddah> and then @ s.e. 45th & belmont
17:44 <aaronpk> there's actually a point in here from 9:50am yesterday with an accuracy of 2.2km
17:44 <faddah> i posted that developer reference because it specifically says you can use a "gps" string in your code to default to the gps chipset in iPhone 4/iOS 4.0.2 to get the gps accuracy
17:45 <aaronpk> i've never seen anything bigger than 500 meters before
17:45 <faddah> yeah, that 2.2 km would be what i call: "away from goodness." :P
17:45 <Loqi> Loqi grabs faddah's tongue
17:45 <aaronpk> did you have the "significant updates" checkbox turned on?
17:45 <donpdonp> faddah: that gps string, i do not think it means what you think it means. <you killed my father, prepare to die>
17:45 <faddah> LETH NGO LOTHQI! LETH NGO!
17:45 <Loqi> o rly?
17:46 <faddah> rly
17:46 <faddah> donpdonp - go read the dev reference, yes it does. and stop saying that
17:47 <faddah> aaronpk - yes, i turned significant updates on. am i not supposed to use that? wouldn't turn on in Xcode iPhone simulator, does on iPhone 4/iOS 4.0.2
17:47 <aaronpk> I think you're the first one to have used the app more than half a day with that turned on
17:47 <faddah> what is that feature s'posed to do, O Loqi master?
17:47 <aaronpk> that's probably making the phone register fewer updates, I bet if you turn it off you'll get more accurate data
17:48 <aaronpk> significant updates asks the phone to wake up the app when the location changes "significantly"
17:48 <aaronpk> which is based on cell tower location, and then the app doesn't use the GPS chip at all, and it should save battery
17:48 <faddah> what does it consider "significant?" is it basing it on the slider settings?
17:48 <aaronpk> it's totally up to iOS, not the app
17:49 <aaronpk> basically the app says "wake me up when something happens" and then goes to sleep
17:49 <aaronpk> and iOS decides when to push locations to it
17:50 <faddah> but what is the heuristic/criteria for that push?
17:50 <faddah> can you make it go by your slider settings instead?
17:50 <aaronpk> secret appley stuff
17:51 <faddah> ok, now it's showing me back at home (now, within the last 20 min. since i last checked) @ s.e. 60th & madison, with wild-ass points at the 42nd/powell location & s.e. 60th & grant (1/4 mile south)
17:51 <aaronpk> no, "significant updates" is an apple thing
17:53 <faddah> no way to pass to the apple servers what you think is "significant"?
17:53 <faddah> just shut "significant updates" off
17:53 <Loqi> dude
17:54 <faddah> would help if these settings were clearer marked/explained
17:54 <aaronpk> In iOS 4.0 and later, you can use the significant-change location service to receive location events. This service offers a significant power savings and provides accuracy that is good enough for most applications. It uses the device’s cellular radio to determine the user’s location and report changes in that location, allowing the system to manage power usage much more aggressively than it could otherwise. This service is also capa
17:55 <aaronpk> yes it would. We're not officially in "beta" yet, but once we are we're going to be documenting these sliders and options fully, and sending out emails to people who have signed up to beta test
17:55 <faddah> "In iOS 4.0 and later, applications can use region monitoring to be notified when the user crosses geographic boundaries. You can use this capability to generate alerts when the user gets close to a specific location. For example, upon approaching a specific dry cleaners, an application could notify the user to pick up any clothes that had been dropped off and are now ready."
17:56 <faddah> so, it would seem, if that were true...
17:56 <faddah> when i person turns "Significant Updates" on...
17:56 <faddah> you go out *to* *gps* *chip* and get location...
17:57 <faddah> set a boundary around that location (100 meters, whatever, or setable in the sliders controls)...
17:57 <faddah> put that around the gps point.
17:57 <faddah> the moment user crosses the boundary with the iPhone — boom, wake up, update.
17:58 <aaronpk> interesting idea
18:01 <faddah> it's the way our lawd jaybus intended it!
18:16 <@caseorganic> @ajturner Thanks for signing up for @geoloqi. Would love to talk for a longer period of time in the future.
18:16 <Loqi> you're welcome
18:18 <donpdonp> faddah: is se45th&belmont pod good for dinner-type food?
18:18 <faddah> showah
18:18 <caseorganic> ask the new ping maps.
18:18 <Loqi> pong
18:18 <caseorganic> haha
18:18 <Loqi> ahahahaha
18:18 <caseorganic> bing, i meant. not ping.
18:18 <Loqi> pong
18:19 <faddah> pong!
18:20 <donpdonp> cool. im going to bike up there.
18:21 <donpdonp> anyone else want to go?
18:21 <caseorganic> ignite speech prep!
18:21 <caseorganic> can't
18:22 <faddah> same same as @caseorganic. plus: i was there 2 hours ago.
18:22 <faddah> feel free to bring me a chili dog from there, tho', donpdonp ;) after all... everyone delivers!
18:22 <faddah> nice ref w/ bing, adding that to my bookmarks for portland
18:23 <donpdonp> donpdonp rolls
18:23 <faddah> haha
18:24 <caseorganic> caseorganic gives Loqi a chili dog
18:24 <Loqi> Loqi enjoys the chili dog
18:25 <faddah> oh sure, you'll get one for the silly loqisaur!
18:52 <@caseorganic> Speaking about data viz, geolocation+@geoloqi at O'Reilly Strata Conf. in Feb '11 Conf. Submissions are open! http://caseorganic.com/1Un
19:34 <donpdonp> the loqisaurs are not extinct after all.
20:19 <@jam1401> RT @caseorganic: Speaking about data viz, geolocation+@geoloqi at O'Reilly Strata Conf. in Feb '11 Conf. Submissions are open! http://caseorganic.com/1Un
20:29 <caseorganic> no longer extinct!
20:30 <caseorganic> yes, but they are... a little different than the original one
20:30 <aaronpk> they're more like loqi's big brothers
20:30 <Loqi> Loqi is done
20:45 <faddah> adorable
20:45 <faddah> so what's this thing where Loqi re-broadcasts caseorganic's tweets?
20:47 <caseorganic> loqi rebroadcasts tweets that contain geoloqi or loqi in them
21:01 <faddah> have mine been rebroadcast here?
21:06 <aaronpk> yup
21:07 <faddah> coolio.
21:17 <@yuetsu> i gotta say: that @geoloqi ? one sexy little dino-beeeyotch.
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23:02 <jtbandes> aaronpk: how can I test this api/auth stuff? making it send api/location is kinda annoying
23:14 <tjgillies> we should make a permanent access token for a testing account
23:15 <jtbandes> nah, I want to test refresh
23:15 <jtbandes> what I really need is a short refresh time